Ep 112: Part 12/12, What if God Sounded Like Music? Former Bible-Smuggler Keith Major Tells All: How to Build a Relationship with God Series

In this episode, Andrea and Janelle drop into a soul-level conversation with Keith Major — once a pastor, now a happiness coach who traded doctrine for embodied joy. Keith shares the gritty truth of his spiritual evolution: the music that kept him alive, the movement that moved him back into his body, and the intuition that guided him out of the boxes he inherited. They explore what it means to talk to God in your own language — to sing your prayers, dance your devotion, and trust the voice inside that whispers, “This way.” You’ll hear:

-Exactly how Keith chose truth over titles

-Stories about motorcycles and bible-smuggling

-Why you don’t need an interpreter to talk to God

-Why vulnerability (truth out loud!) is often disguised as a breakdown

-How to stop outsourcing your worth to religion and relationships

-One way to make community your medicine

-How to tap into the divine. Every day. On Venice Beach.

Find Keith online at Major Change

TRANSCRIPT:

Janelle Orion 0:00

Janelle, struggling to discuss sex and intimacy with your partner, not feeling met, seen or heard in your relationships. I'm Janelle And I'm Andrea. We're two midlife Mavericks sharing our own experiences, messy, AF and no regrets with marriage, divorce, polyamory and pleasure. We've learned that when you're brave enough to figure out what you want and ask for it, with partners, friends, family and most importantly, yourself, you'll feel more alive and free question everything, especially your mother's advice. There's no rom com formula for this. But don't panic. Being alone matters, honey, I can't miss you if you don't leave, what if your breakup could be your breakthrough? Our podcast is for brave hearts. Anyone who seeks or has found the courage to confront their fears and limiting beliefs about breaking societal norms in the spirit of finding their truth. If you're seeking permission to be brave in your relationships and want to feel less alone along the way, we got you.

Janelle Orion 1:07

Okay, Bravehearts, you've got another like I want to take juicy, loving,

Andrea Enright 1:16

radiant, compassionate, yes, so full of love this guy, Keith, wow, I just learned that I could, maybe I should weave dancing and singing into my morning prayer. Maybe that is a way to talk to the universe.

Janelle Orion 1:34

Yeah, Keith shares his story with us. Of I'm not actually sure how old he is now, but in his 50s, where he has just this summer, jumped off the diving board through as a result of an accident to live his fullest expression of himself. And I'm so proud of him. His courage is such an inspirational for all of

Andrea Enright 1:55

us listening, yeah, and he's spread God's Word in many ways, as a pastor in Russia on the streets of Baton Rouge in the Middle East, Qatar in the middle Fuddruckers and guitar spreading so much love. And now he's listening to both himself and God, and we get to benefit. So yeah, coming up.

Andrea Enright 2:24

Hi, brave hearts. Welcome to another episode of permission to be human. I'm Andrea and I'm Janelle, and this is the next installment of our season five, how to build a relationship with God, with spirit, with the higher being, with the universe, with the cooperative Why did the last person call it cooperative beings? I love that. So we all call it something different, but it's been a journey to listen to so many different perspectives on building that relationship, and I'm excited today we have Keith major, and he's actually a I can tell already, he is a Burning Man friend of janelle's. So we're gonna get a little intro about Keith as well as you know, let's just pop in a quick story about Burning Man too, yes.

Janelle Orion 3:23

Keith major is a former pastor and now a trained sex and happiness coach who lives in Los Angeles. Growing up Catholic, turned Baptist, back to Catholic. He wasn't allowed to dance. Now in his 50s, he's passionate about all kinds of movement, including ecstatic dance, five rhythms and free form. And yes, Keith and I met 2022 in Costa Rica at a Tantra retreat. But we have also seen each other. We camped together dark heart in 2022 as well. And yeah, have danced together on many a dance floor in a burning man. And he is such a heart led human, it's pretty spectacular. And I'm so grateful, Keith, to have you on our podcast today.

Keith Major 4:18

Thank you for having me

Andrea Enright 4:21

a heart led human who is a trained sex and happiness coach. Amazing. So I'm hearing Janelle. You met Keith when you were visiting me in Costa Rica and going to the Yes, right, going to the retreat in Costa Rica.

Janelle Orion 4:33

Yes, he and I connected shamanically, magically over the fact that both of us had this like, deep Catholic background.

Andrea Enright 4:41

Oh, okay, all right. Well, how's this set so meant to be you were connecting about Catholicism in Costa Rica at your Tantra retreat?

Janelle Orion 4:50

Yep, we were there to heal.

Andrea Enright 4:52

Yes, so, Keith, what do you call this higher being? What's What's your name? That you.

Keith Major 5:00

Is, I mean, all my life, I call him God, but when I was a pastor, you know, I didn't want to ruffle people's feathers. And I've never been afraid of non Christians. Seems like there's a lot of Christians that are afraid of like, don't go to Burning Man, because the demons will jump on you. It's a pagan festival, and so, I mean, that was my farewell. I never went. I mean, I only went in 2022 because someone gave me a ticket, like the week before. But even up until then, I'm like, That sounds scary. That's that's something that you shouldn't do, because you can open yourself up to things. But I, I wouldn't go to like places, but I would meet people and I and I wanted to talk their language. So, you know, I know some people would call it the universe or different things. So I just tried to be trilingual, or bilingual, and just like, how did they express God? Because if I would pray with someone as a pastor who wasn't a Christian, I know if I would say the word Jesus, they might get like, okay, stop praying. I don't want that. So I would just pray like, oh, creator, you know, be with Betsy or, you know. And of course, that was kind of neutral, you know. And I know who I'm talking about. So whether it be universe, the Creator God. Just use those words interchangeably.

Keith Major 6:24

Yeah, love it. I like this creator, this creator word, love it. So how did you first start building a relationship with creator Keith?

Keith Major 6:35

I was Catholic until I was eight, and when I was seven, my dad started to attend some Catholic charismatic meetings at the parish, and they were open to the Holy Spirit. And here's these Catholics praying in tongues and praying for sick people and doing the stuff that Jesus did, you know? And so I was just watching, I'm like, okay, you know? So you could have this prayer like, so I prayed, yeah, they really leaned into like, you could hear God for yourself. And so for me, I, you know, as an eight year old, I'm like, Okay, I could so I would pray. And I prayed very specific prayers, you know, my parents left the Catholic Church and became Baptist, and that was kind of like a charismatic Baptist Church, too. And same thing, you know, I went to the school as well. And, you know, you couldn't listen to rock music, couldn't dance, so it's kind of like a Footloose thing, but like, so I grew up listening to only Christian music, and I listened to so many like, I mean, it's almost like, we call it praise and worship. So I basically what I would learn how to do is, like how to sing to God. So that was, to answer your question, is I would sing my prayers to God. And I don't know, it just kind of felt like almost a two way thing happening, because I would sing prayers to him, and I could kind of hear downloads from him, even from my my junior high, you know, elementary school years, high school years, and I thought that was normal.

Andrea Enright 8:12

Okay, okay, so let me, I just, I want to note that you said someone told you you can hear God yourself. It's an interesting line, because it's saying, No, you have a direct line to God, like you don't have to go through a priest. You don't have to go through like you can talk to him directly. So just getting that message early on, am I getting that right? Yeah. And then this influx of music, which is like such an important part of my life, is beautiful that this was your channel with God, is that right?

Keith Major 8:42

I would be a teenager and have a guitar strapped around my neck and just play chords and just sing spontaneously whatever came to my mind. And when I would sing it, it would last longer. So I would like pray for 30 minutes. Sometimes I'd pray for an hour with my guitar on, strapped on me, and I'm just

Janelle Orion 9:05

somehow, somehow. Is there any prayer you feel right now that you can

Janelle Orion 9:11

Yeah, yeah. Can you sing one please?

Keith Major 9:15

Right now? Yeah, right now. Oh, yeah. Absolutely.

Keith Major 9:20

Hmm. Oh,

Keith Major 9:28

God, I thank you for the open doors you give us for the synchronicities and the divine appointments that help make us grow, that help us know more about you, that help us deeper in our healing, to help us find our purpose, to show us how to love. Help us be vessels of love, open and pure. Open our eyes to see the world the way you do. So if you can put like contact lens in my eye so I can see the way you do and give me the courage and the grace to walk it out in fullness and thank you for loving me. That's Oh, my god, so good.

Janelle Orion 10:45

Oh so beautiful, so earnest, so courageous on so many levels. Yeah, yeah. So vulnerable, the definition of a brave heart right there, put on this rock to sing us all.

Janelle Orion 10:59

Oh, my God. This was just karma, because I would put people on the spot because I I told people, like, when you would pray for them, you know, like, I'm like, Hey, touch them, but first ask for consent. Like, like, hey, you know, can I, can I put my hands on your shoulders and pray for you? And so they would, and of course, that's a stretch for people to, like, lay hands on people and pray for them. But people need touch. You know, if Jesus did it, why can't I do it? You know, he says, but I would challenge people like, hey, you know, what would be deeper is if you sing your prayer over them, and people just look at me like, Are you kidding me? Like, that's scary as heck. And I'm like, Yes, but I tell you, the times that I've sung prayers over people, I would just see tears come down their eyes, because it just kind of like it was, like, so vulnerable, and it just pierced their hearts. It just went deeper. And so, I mean, I taught hundreds and hundreds of people how to just sing prayers over people, and now he put me in his spot. I'm like, Oh, wow. That's, that's, uh, was I ready for that? You know? But, um, of course, you never know when these opportunities, these pop up and you have to do it in senior prayer over people.

Janelle Orion 12:16

Wow. What an impact you've had.

Keith Major 12:19

The funny thing is, as though, with Janelle saying like, through movement, I It's now evolved to like, Wow, can I dance my prayer over you. And there's times that I'm just like, with song and with movement, that's my prayer now. So it's kind of evolved. But still I sing, wow.

Janelle Orion 12:39

I'm just, I'm blown away. Like, I'm just like, Oh, I'm like, Could I just, like, dance, my prayer, yeah, you can instead, right? Because I love to dance and I love to sing.

Keith Major 12:49

Think about it. Like when they say, like, 80% of communication is body

Keith Major 12:54

language. This is true.

Keith Major 12:56

So like, you know, I could send a text, but it would be easier to send a voice message. So you can hear the tonation in my voice, but that's just you hearing me. But like, if you see me via zoom, you're like, Oh, I hear His voice and intonation and the body language. So in a way, just think of like when you're moving, your body language says so much. So if you want to dance, a prayer of me, go ahead. You know, I might receive that more because that's way more vulnerable than a song even.

Janelle Orion 13:26

Oh my gosh. Here we go. Here we go. I'm totally dancing.

Janelle Orion 13:37

Yeah, loving, right? I love it. And what's coming to me is that what as part of my script for an upcoming presentation was like, may I be empty and open to receive the light, may I be empty and open to receive. This is what's been playing in my head for the last like week. And yeah, I think that could be my like every morning. I just did it this morning for the first time. I just, like, did, did that line of the song. Wow, clearly I was supposed to talk to you today.

Janelle Orion 14:08

And Keith, I want you to know that you just what you just inspired, because Andrea has never sung on the podcast before,

Keith Major 14:14

really? Wow.

Janelle Orion 14:15

No, I guess not. Well, I will have to say this to you,

Keith Major 14:19

because, like, I realized right when you sang, I'm like, it's harder to sing acapella, but if I had my guitar on me, and I've already strummed a few songs, I know that the chord progression and it's easier, but like when I was just making up as I go, I'm like, Oh man, I don't have a guitar to follow with. So anyway, so kudos. You did it without, without any instrument. You know, could you imagine how much it will be with an instrument?

Janelle Orion 14:46

Did it? It's true. It's true. I'm used to doing it without an instrument, because I'm part of a choir, but I rarely, I never sing by myself, like I haven't done any solos. So you inspired my confidence, obviously. So I'm just like, Oh, he's singing. I can sing too. That's That's what.

Keith Major 15:00

One thing on that. I don't think there's been one time that, when I taught people how to sing their prayer, that every time everyone was beautiful, even when it was out of tune or off pitch, I would just look at the person, I'm like, wow, that's that's sweet and very courageous, you know. And there's never been a bad song out of pitch or out of tune.

Andrea Enright 15:23

Janelle and I both have our own kind of stories about song and dance and singing in our voice and finding that. But I'm so I'm curious, Keith, what is your story around that? When did you start singing or playing the guitar. And was there anything you had to overcome to do that?

Keith Major 15:44

No, I started playing at prayer meetings when I was a teenager. And so, you know, we'd have Bible studies, and normally, you know, you sing some Christian they call them praise and worship songs, songs that you normally sing at, like non denominational or evangelical churches. So I, you know, I'd play those, but then I would play them, but I loved after we played, like, four songs, just like, let's get into a spontaneous vein. And like, I'm playing these cards, and I will, might. I'll start with something spontaneous, and I'll leave it open, and others could join in and spontaneously sing, and that's straight from the heart, because it's not like I'm singing songs of a song that I know this is like, what's alive in you right now. Sing that. Sing that,

Andrea Enright 16:34

yes, yes. I didn't catch because I was probably so excited about the music. Did this come from the Baptist side, or the Catholic side.

Keith Major 16:44

You know, when it started with the Catholic charismatic side, because they were doing this, you know, they were like, you know, this was like late 70s, so they would have, like a full band on the side of the the sacristy. I mean, not the SAC Well, you know, on the side where the altar is and and then whenever my parents left that to go to a Baptist church, it was very similar. But, you know, even my personality, just like I've always, kind of had a creative kind of part to me, artist or sing.

Janelle Orion 17:16

So I'd love to hear the continuation of your journey. So you were, you were playing these songs with the guitar, helping others find their voice with God through your teens. And what happened next?

Keith Major 17:30

I had a youth minister. He wanted us to go and evangelize other teens at a dance club. So I grew up in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, so there was a dance club. And so he says, Let's just hang out in the parking lot and try to evangelize these people about to go into a dance club, you know, and sin, you know. So, or maybe we could catch them before they go in and send or we could catch them when they come back out, you know. And so I was never the person with the megaphone saying turn or burn. I just have always been compassionate side and just like I want to hear stories, you know, I had a landscaping company when I was in high school, and so when I was out mowing yards, and I think in high school, I probably had about 30 clients, I'd have a little Sony Walkman, and I'd have my praise and worship music in my ear ears, just singing, sitting on my right lawnmower, and I would ask, God, give me creative, witty icebreakers so that when I was out in the parking lot that it wouldn't just be the same old line, like, Hey, if you were to die tonight, would you go to heaven or hell? Like, those are the cheesy things that people you see people on the street, like, oh my god, do I have to answer that question? Like, I'm not interested. Like, so scoot that aside. So even in my teenage years, I'm like, What's something creative for that person? And so almost like, during the week, I'd pray, like, give me a new icebreaker, and he would just give me new icebreakers, and I just be waiting, you know, in the parking lot, and then someone would walk by, and I'm like, Hey, and I would use my new icebreaker on them, and we would just get into this great conversation. And I prayed for many people, and they cried, and they're like, I want what you have. I'm like, Okay, let me. Let me introduce them to you. Can you

Janelle Orion 19:23

give me an example of one of those icebreakers? Like, what were you saying to people? I literally was just it was in wash park a couple weeks ago. It was homecoming for my daughter's High School. There was, like, probably hundreds of kids in the park taking pictures, and there was a guy standing with a microphone, really bad sound quality, talking about God. Felt like such a disruption, kind of to the atmosphere, because it was like this tech that didn't sound very good. And then also, I felt okay, well, like he thinks he's doing a good thing, you know, he's. Trying with compassion. And he was probably 17. He was really young, so I had this in my mind. I could see you in the park or the parking lot doing this. How did you make this better? What was something you said to someone?

Keith Major 20:15

I would ask God to highlight them. And so a highlighter, like when you read a book and you like a sentence, you take your yellow highlighter and you highlight them. So if God would give me, like, these impressions, I'm like, Okay, well, there's like 100 people here, like, can you make it easier for me? Because I'm trying to do this for you. Help me out here. God highlight someone. And so he would, and it would just be pretty clear. So in the Christian war. We'd call it prophetic, you know, just practicing your prophetic gift, or gift of discernment, or having words of wisdom or words of knowledge. And so, yeah, I remember, I was with a friend, and so we were a tag team, and I'm like, Man, I feel like compelled that we got to talk to that, that woman right there. So he says, Okay, so we're, like, starting to approach her, and she kind of made a turn, and they had, like, some people doing some tarot card readings, and so she just sat down in front of one of them. He says, ah, we missed our opportunity, you know? She's now on their side. And I'm like, No, she's not like, let's just wait for her to be done, you know. And sure enough, when she was done, she got up and she started walking toward us, and I just approached her, and again, like he's now afraid, like something jumped on her at the tarot card table, you know? And I'm like, No, it's a human that paid some money, I guess, to have a reading. So she walked, she was walking by my way, and I'm like, oh, did you just get your get a reading? She says, yeah. I'm like, Well, how was it? She's like, Yeah, it was okay. She says, Why do you ask? You know, do you know those people, or are you a competitor? And I'm like, I said, those people wish they had what I had. And she immediately just put her hands out, and she says, Okay, give me a reading. And like, I don't I don't know what to do. I've never done that before, and so I'm just like, um. And so I just grabbed her hands. When God's calling me out there to, like, do something, I'm like, Okay, God, I'm trusting you to, like, give me the words to say, because I don't have any words to say. And most of the times he'd say, just say the first sentence, and I'll give you the rest of the paragraph. I'm like, can you give me the paragraph first? And so I felt like, God was like, testing my faith. He's like, so I've done this so many times in my life. I know sometimes he's like, these are your first two words. And I just now, I just go, like, okay, because I know he gives me the rest. So it's just testing muscles, you know? And so I walked up to her. So as soon as I grabbed her hands, I'm like, Okay, I'm not getting nothing. So if I don't have anything, what I can give you is an encouraging word. Nothing wrong with that, huh? So, so I just grabbed her hands, I said I forgot what her name was or something. Let's just say Jane. I'm like, Jane, when I look at you, I see and like, right when I was about to say something, my friend said, Hey, can I stop you? Do you have pain in your shoulder right here? And she said, How'd you know? And he says, I don't know. I had this feeling in my shoulder, and usually I feel something, if it's something that we need to pray for. She says, Yeah, I got it in a car accident. I've had pain there ever since. And so we prayed for her, and the pain kind of lessened. And she's like, Who are you folks? And we just in our conversation, she started crying, and she said, Oh my God. She says, I came here because of a friend's wedding, and I don't know anyone in this town, and the reception is over, and I decided to just go dancing. And she says, as I was driving here, I asked, God, if You're real, I'll give you a second chance, because her mom and dad were both in ministry, and they both had affairs, and so they broke up, and the ministries went down in smoke, and she saw the mess, and she's like, I'm done with Christianity. And so then, you know, she's driving to this club, and she meets me and my friend, and I'm like, I am so sorry. I don't know. It's just it was a conversation, you know? And it was, it was, Wow, it's beautiful. So I'm like, Well, where do you live? And so at this so she told me where she lived. It was out of state, and I knew someone in the town. I'm like, let me give you a telephone number a friend, and she'll have tea with you and introduce you to a church you can go to. And so that's just one of hundreds and hundreds of things I've done. Oh, so the thing is just like, so I did that for a number of years, and then I moved to Russia to pastor a church there

Janelle Orion 24:48

that feels like a whole chapter. We do a whole episode on that about Russia. Wait, so How then would you describe your relationship with. God. Like, you know, are you? Yeah, at this moment, like, I feel

Keith Major 25:05

that we still co labor together. How many people have you talked to on your episodes that have seen God, touch God, heard God, felt God, and so I think we're humans, and have this human experience. He's like, hey, I need to work through. Some of you like conduit. So are you willing to be conduit? Are you willing to be his hands, his feet, his mouth, or just a voice to go through? And so before, I think so many of my Christian friends have this phobia of like, oh, you know, what's God's will in my life? Because if I miss it, I miss it, you know. And I guess my question to them now is, like, what do you want to do? Because God could work with any hand you're dealt with. You're like, Oh, you have that. God's like, I can work with it. And so what do I want to do? And I'm like, and he's like, Yeah, let's let's co labor and work together.

Andrea Enright 25:58

I'm hearing that you trust in what he offers you, in the words he's giving you to spread. Yes, do you ever question that? No, in

Janelle Orion 26:09

your bio, you said you're a former pastor, right? And now you're a trained sex and happiness coach. And what I'm hearing is that your relationship to God doesn't feel like it's changed, right? That you are seeing yourself as a vessel or conduit for God's works, if you will. All that has changed is, I'll say, like the medium or the framework of which you are choosing to express God's thoughts will, and I think it's probably based partly because you're like, Oh, what do I want? So now I want to be in this realm of sex and happiness, which is not the realm of pastoring, but God's still here.

Keith Major 27:04

You know, in a way, I feel like I still pastor and I still build communities. It just doesn't have the name church on it, because when I moved to Russia when I was 21 I helped friends smuggle in 100,000 Bibles into the Soviet Union. And when we're handing them out. These Russians are like, are you just going to give us these Bibles and leave? Like, who's going to teach us this? You know? And so I volunteered to stay, and so we had a church of about 2000 people within six months. And I'm like, Oh, my God. I did not expect this, but I guess I was kind of wired for it. So I ended up helping start three churches. So it's building communities from scratch up until covid time. I worked for the Catholic Church in the Archdiocese of LA, so I directly reported to my Bishop, who I love dearly. I was helping him build things. And whenever covid happened and they just shut down the church for a year, like there was, like no mass for a year. It was kind of like my first sabbatical in like a decade. And so during that time, I the primary book I read most of my life, till I was 49 was the Bible, because I was led to believe all of your answers are in the Bible, until I went back to grad school, and one of my professors was a clinical psychologist, and he says, you might need to go to therapy, you know, because I described my marriage to him, and when I described my marriage, I'm like, Well, I've been, you know, wanting to go to marital counseling with my spouse for a very long time. And he says, Well, have you gone? I'm like, No, she doesn't want to go. And he says, You need to go yourself. So I went by myself. And for after I had my first therapy session, I consumed 25 psychology books. And like that first year, I'm like, I stuck them down, and then I had coffee with my bishop. And I'm like, Bishop, oh, my God, there's so many pastors and priests practicing without a license. He says, What do you mean, Keith? And I'm like, my god, like, as a pastor, I could hear what you have to say to me, and I could have empathy and compassion, and I can say like, oh, Andrea or Janelle, let me pray for you, but when I'm done praying, can I refer you to this person? I mean, I need to have a Rolodex like that. First semester, we had to have a Rolodex of 50 therapist names, if it was from AA or or any kind of organization, so I could just refer them to and not just pick something random, I don't think so. I was just telling the bishop. I said, So many Christians because they they feel like they don't hear God's voice. They so heavily lean into a pastor like Pastor. What should I do? And so here you might wear a collar if you're a Catholic priest or you can be a Protestant pastor. And they. Expect like them to tell them the answers what to do. And I have to be honest, I think a very large number of priests and pastors enter into spiritual abuse because I'm giving you advice outside of my lane of expertise, and they need to refer you to see you might need to see a therapist that I didn't go to seminary to study psychology. You know, people go to seminary to study theology and philosophy, so please refer and don't make things up and shoot from the hip. So I was telling that to my bishop, and he's like, oh yeah. I'm like, they need to start teaching psychology in seminary so people are going to go to confession and, like, priests are going to hear confessions. And anyway, so I so I found that, like, I when the church kind of shut down, people just started coming to me and like, what should I do? And I started, like, let me, let me refer you to a therapist you need to do this, or let me pray for you. So, so, yeah, yeah.

Andrea Enright 31:06

So I'm gonna stop you for a second. I so I'm hearing that in your journey, you saw people, and including yourself, looking outside themselves for guidance. And that was probably something you it sounds like you've done your whole life too. You were looking to God and God was talking to you for a lot of your life. But it now I'm hearing that in therapy, maybe you learned to go inward. Yes, is that correct? And so,

Keith Major 31:34

yes, yes, hmm, I think with that, to answer your question, I'm glad you brought that up, because I had so much from the church world say, like, die to your flesh, take up your cross to a point that you know the flesh is evil, you know, and and so, like, I so second guessed my gut and my instinct and my intuition, and I think what you just mentioned was like no trust your gut and trust your intuition, and what is it saying to you, and it might be giving you truer answers in what we're hearing From some leaders in the church beautiful.

Andrea Enright 32:22

So do you consider a relationship with God different than a relationship with self?

Keith Major 32:31

I'd say no, because I can only give you what I have. I remember the festival that I was at with Janelle in Costa Rica. It was, like, the last day, and it was my birthday, my my 52nd birthday, and people were just around the room sharing. And like, three people in that closing circle shared, and they're like, beep, beep, beep, the church, you know, beep the church, for all that they did. And I heard, like, three people share this, and I was just like, and I'm like, no one knew I was a former pastor there, and so I was the last one to share. And I just went, Hey, can I can I share? I'm like, I'm like, Hi guys, um, you don't know, but I'm a former pastor. And they had, like, I don't know, maybe eight people do, like, a silent mouth scream. They were shaking, like, venting, like, Oh, I hope I don't trigger anyone by saying this. And I just said, I just want to apologize, as a former pastor, for the things that Christians do, because in the Scripture says, Love your neighbor as yourself. And I said, I think what some of you get with Christians as they do that is they love you like they love themselves. And most Christians don't like themselves because of shame and guilt. And so they're going to do unto you as they do unto themselves and they throw that on you. So wow, is that what we need? More guilt, more shame, more so I think we have to love ourselves if we love God, because how can I love him and not love myself? But there's so many Christians like, I love God. I've sacrificed for God. I did this for God, but I am so freaking miserable. That's my story. I mean, I'm a happy go lucky person, like I was freaking miserable up until the time I was 50 years old. I'm like, something's got to change, because I've prayed for a breakthrough and for answers and nothing was happening. I'm like, is there something else? And I think just something in me, just like, do some research, do some work. So, I mean, I

Andrea Enright 34:50

studied psychology. Thank you for that connection that you just described between the relationship with self and the relationship with God. Because I just, I saw the intro. We. Leaving there perfectly. And it's something that I've experienced too, in that at some point I realized, oh, when I'm judging myself less, I'm judging others less. It sounds like people had a relationship with God. That was distance, but they were still judging themselves right for not doing this right or not doing that right, and then that just translated to others, right? So really, we're just spreading judgment, even though we have this relationship with God, so unfortunate, and now you've built a better a loving relationship with yourself. Has that changed? Then your relationship with God?

Keith Major 35:36

I feel like I'm more spiritual in tuned now than I've ever been, because I'm trusting Keith too. I mean, so much changed when I was 50 because I said something had to change when I was 50, because I moved out of a 26 year marriage when I when I was 50, and then I filed when I was 51 what took me so long was the teachings of the Church. They're like, if you divorce someone, even if it's an unhealthy marriage, if you get remarried, because, like, I would want to get remarried, but if you get remarried, so the sin for Catholics are not divorce. The sins in the Catholic Church is like, you could get divorced, but then stay single the rest of your life, because if you get remarried and then you have sexual intimacy with your second wife, you're committing adultery, and you can't have communion. And I'm like, Ah, so basically, if you get divorced and remarried, you're going to be committing adultery each time you sleep with your new spouse, and you're going to go to hell. And I'm like, I don't want to go to hell. Like, is sex worth hell? No, so I just stayed in the marriage until I was 50. I'm like, what if they're wrong? What if I don't go to hell if I divorce? And I thought for myself, and if there's Christians or Catholics looking at please think for yourself, you are not going to go to hell for divorcing. I don't know your case, but for me, there's no judgment, and I know there's people that do judge me, and I let that suppress my happiness and joy for decades. And it's not worth it. It's not worth what they think, or what the church thinks, or what the priest thinks, or what Pastor thinks, when you're miserable and you're not loving yourself, so when you're not hitting on all cylinders. Because I remember when I some missionaries, I also lived in the Middle East for three years, and some missionaries were just like, oh my god, you work for this guy? And I'm like, yeah. And they're like, why aren't you doing like? And I'm like, You know what I I remember, I was in Qatar, sitting at thud Ruckers restaurant, talking with a bunch of missionaries there, and I said, I said, yeah, there was a thud records there, and I'm sitting there, I was sitting there, and they're like, Keith, we need you. You know, we need you at full potential. I'm like, I feel like an eight cylinder engine hitting on four cylinders. And they're like, We want Keith on eight cylinders. You know, what's it going to take? And they asked me the question. I'm like, I guess pray more. I guess fast more. I need to pray more and fast more. So I did that, and it didn't solve the problem, because the problem was my marriage.

Andrea Enright 38:15

So much courage. Yeah, that's what I was gonna say. You had, like, wow, right?

Janelle Orion 38:20

This is the theme that I'm hearing actually through all of these episodes on this, on building relationship with God. Is that to for many, many people, it actually takes a tremendous amount of courage to find the relationship with God that is true for them, because it requires not believing what someone else has told them about what God is

Andrea Enright 38:45

for many, many, many years. I mean, wow, yeah, you were such a brave heart, like you, really. You found the courage to sort of break, to confront those limiting fears and beliefs, to break what was your societal norm in search of your truth? It's beautiful. Do you think that having a relationship with creator helps you find peace in the suffering of the world? Or do you think? Do you think it helps you help the less fortunate

Keith Major 39:19

in the book of Genesis, if we're created in God's image, you know, it's a little bit of God in me, you know, it's where there's a lot of God in me, more than I gave myself recognition for, you know, I think that which is in me just would have compassion to want to help people and like, your question, is it God, or is it me? It's both. It's God in me and me and God, before we started this podcast, you know, you're like, I told you both that, like, I've never, this is the first time, kind of like, like, sharing my story, because I just been under the radar, just kind. Of word of mouth up until now. And you're like, take some deep breaths, you know? And like, we're all one, and that's, that's a lovely thing, you know, that we are just one, just humans, just trying to get through another day, another week, another year. And how can we make it easier? One another, really, the only thing worth doing is really loving. So how can we do that better?

Janelle Orion 40:26

Keith, I'd love for you to share briefly the story, right? Like you, as you said, like you're, you're quite nervous getting on this podcast, but that there something happened this summer where you're like, I'm not gonna hide. Basically, I want to say this, like, loving heart that I have any longer

Keith Major 40:45

when I share my story with people, so many people, like, when is your book going to get out? So I'm like, You know what? I need to start writing this thing down, because I think there's healing involved. And people are going to go, like, Oh, I think the whole thing with the ME TOO movement, it gave women kind of a voice of like, Oh, I'm not alone in this. I know there's 10s of 1000s, if not hundreds of 1000s, of stuck Christians or stuck people, and if my story has a little bit of medicine in it to kind of like, help them get over the hump, great. So I started writing that, and then in May, I was riding on my motorcycle in LA and someone got out of the carpool lane and sideswiped me. And this is funny, you know, because I thought in the moment of my death, automatically, like I'm going to say, oh, dear Jesus, forgive me. You know, it's like, it's like, have that program in your brain, because the moment that you die, you know, at least get your sins forgiven, you know. And that did not come out of my mouth whenever a car hit me, going 55 and I just knew I was about to die like when you hit cement going 55 and cars are going 55 behind you. Most motorcyclists get hit by the cars behind them. The first thing when it hit me, I just went, oh shit. And my head hit the sidewalk. I mean, the concrete first, and I heard a snap, and then I just blanked out. I just blacked out. And then when the person behind me was a nurse, and, you know, they got me to the hospital, and the doctor said, while you are very lucky that you only have six broken ribs in multiple spots, a broken clavicle and a collapsed lung, I mean punctured lung, because this could have been way different. And I just felt like, Oh, God, you gave me a second chance. Because I've been so afraid on the edge of the diving board just looking at, like the 10 foot deep water. I'm like, I don't know if I'm ready to jump off of that this year, like as a kid. And I'm like, Ah, is this the year that I'm going to come out and do this more on the public level? And I don't know, I think that motorcycle when I was in the hospital, it was just like, God, just like, like, pushed me up the diving board. And I'm like, Oh, this was not as scary as I thought. And I dance a lot, and dance has been part of my healing modality of just somatic movement. I have some belly, something on my belly, and so I said, you know, I'm not going to dance without a shirt on, because I dance on the beach and stuff, because some guys, you know, we sweat so you when you dance, I'm like, I'm keeping my shirt on because I was a little ashamed of my body, and I tell you what, I was signed up for a 30 day zoom dance class the month of May. And so I was in that Zoom class that morning, doing my somatic dance. And then the very next day, we had it. I'm in my hospital bed in the trauma unit, and I have a cast on this arm and a sling in this arm, and really, all I could do is move my fingers, and my shirt was off, and I'm like, I am going to dance without my shirt, with my fingers, because I am so goddamn proud of my body, because it helped me survive, because it's so rugged. And, you know, I don't know just how I'm built. I'm like, why would I be ashamed to show this to dance, you know? So I dance probably, like, two weeks without my shirt on. I'm like, I am proud of my body, and why did I ever have shame on it? Because I weigh 40 pounds more than I should. Who cares? I'm alive. And so anyway, that's just kind of like I felt like in the hospital when you're in an arcade game, like I'm not a gamer, but like in high school, you know, you're at the Pizza Hut and you're playing Pac Man or whatever, and I feel like I'm playing this game, and like my energy's about to run out, and then you grab the bag. Backpack, and you put the backpack on in the game, and you have your energy restored. And I felt like, as I was driving home from the hospital, I just had this image. It's like your energy is going to be restored completely, but times two, so you're just going to be Keith 2.0 so the potency you had before the accident just got doubled. So please go and spread my medicine, because I have a lot of medicine to offer, and it's pretty potent. And like, why am I just keeping it to myself?

Andrea Enright 45:34

Yeah, this. I mean, I feel the love emanating from you across the screen when you said, Do this, right? Did you mean just go spread love two times? Or did you mean your current profession?

Keith Major 45:49

I think just be me when I go places, just people I don't know, like people like I feel safe when you're in the room, or I feel security, or I feel grounded, or I feel loved, or I feel and that's just me. Or can we say, is it God in me, or is it just me and God, or is it just he? You know, he, she, they. Creator made me this way.

Andrea Enright 46:15

You were given permission somehow to fully express So are there any rituals or practices in your life now that you go through every morning, do you still sing or dance to God? Or what does that look like on a daily basis?

Keith Major 46:30

Well, I live a mile and a half away from Venice Beach. So, you know, a nice walk on the beach is nice. I dance four times a week. You know? The funny thing is, is, like growing up, the things that were told me that are bad or demons could enter you, still, to this day, there's Christians that think yoga, you'll have demons possess you when you do yoga. And I'm like, You know what? I've been doing yoga for like, 20 years, and I could honestly say that I don't think a demon has entered me doing yoga, you know. So people could say with I don't believe him, and if your pastor says it from the pulpit, really, you're going to believe him, because he's your pastor. Well, he's probably never stepped a day in a yoga class. What does he know? Movement, yoga. You know, I did yoga for so long without connecting it to like breath. I just did it like, I'll just stretch. And I'm not going to say those strange names. I'll say the English versions of them, as if one or another is going to affect it. But I think when I linked really breathing with with the yoga, I'm like, Oh, I can really tap into my body. And I think the biggest thing that up until the time when I stopped working for the church, was I didn't know what this word embodiment meant. And so I'm like, What is embodiment, you know? So I had a friend that was an embodiment coach, and she's like, Yeah, we need to get you back touch, you know, and what you're healing your heart, you know? Because I don't know. I think just through my life and through my marriage, my heart probably got a little smaller and a little colder and a little harder, and I'm like, How do I thaw out my smaller, colder, smaller heart? And so embodiment just kind of, like just kind of opened me up in a way that, like going to church didn't.

Andrea Enright 48:30

So I hear that somatic, really a somatic approach is really the biggest way that that you you pray. Is there anything you would suggest to brave hearts if they're feeling lost in their relationship with God. Like, where did they start?

Keith Major 48:48

I'd say, like, knock and just ask. I think God loves a challenge. So if you just like, as you set your prayer or your intention, just like, speak to me. Show me. Show me who you are. Put people across my path today that is going to help serve my greater good and help align with my purpose. I pray that a lot, and that happens a lot, just people cross my path. I'm like, oh my god, I needed to see that person today, and I just kind of expect it now, because it's happened so much in my life.

Andrea Enright 49:27

Like, is there a way that that people can reach you as a sex and happiness coach?

Keith Major 49:33

Well, you could go to my website. It's major change.co. Love it so major change, because there's been so many major changes in my life, and my last name is Major so thus the major change.

Keith Major 49:49

Yeah, so good.

Janelle Orion 49:53

Oh my gosh. My brain parts, my heart is just bursting, like witnessing my dear friend Keith. I'm watching him expand before my eyes on this podcast, and he is such a testament to the courage that all of us have, that we're willing sometimes we might be looking over that diving board, and then sometimes something beyond our control pushes us off of it. And so then the question is, is, what do you do when you're in the air? And I what I'm seeing right now is keep flying, and I'm so proud of you,

Keith Major 50:32

I must say, at the beginning of the program, you stated, like at this retreat, we went on, we got partnered for this one activity together, and we had to share our intention. And I didn't talk to Janelle up until being partnered on this one activity. And I'm like, What is your intention? And she's like, I just want correct me if you know, if I get it off a little bit, but something like you wanted, like sexual freedom and liberation for Catholics. And I was, I looked at him like all people I get paired with. I'm like, yes to that, you know. And I'm like, What's and you said, like, Well, my dad was a priest and my mom used to be a nun, and they left, you know, the priesthood and the convent to get married and and I gave you that number one plus one equals three, and you became the three to that one plus one. And I'm like, wow, it's honor to meet this magical woman who has a background like this. And so yeah, we had the same intention, like, yeah, we hope people do experience freedom and happiness in this area, and not shame and condemnation and guilt.

Andrea Enright 51:47

Yeah, wow. My mouth literally hurts from smiling. I just like, love, love. I love you. You're so amazing. Like, like, I just feel so much love coming from you. So like, I really appreciate that, and you've just given me permission to, like, use dancing and singing as I know that I'm gonna find a way to weave it a little bit more into my ritual prayer practice. So thank you so much for coming on today. Thanks for being so vulnerable, sharing your story and spreading the love.

Keith Major 52:19

Thank you. Thank you for having me. Thank you Keith. Thank you,

Andrea Enright 52:23

bravehearts for listening, and we'll see you next time. Keep on loving.

Janelle Orion 52:33

Hey, Bravehearts, looking for permission. Work with us. Andrea offers permission coaching, and Janelle offers erotic wellness sessions. Follow us on Instagram, meet us in real life at permission to be human workshops in Denver. Subscribe to our newsletter. Do all this and more at our website, permission to be human. Dot live you.