Looking for belonging? Head to Burning Man. Janelle’s been nine times. Her templemate, Dãmasa, was a newbie. Andrea interviews them both (Permission to be Human’s First Guest!) and is surprised how the mundane dust mixes so easily with magical strangers. Port-a-pottys! Permission! Glamping in harsh conditions. There’s a nod to the Paiute Tribe culture and history as Black Rock City’s indigenous people. You’ll hear:
--How Burning Man helped Janelle find herself, her boundaries and her desires
--How chimes helped Dãmasa find Janelle in a white out
--Why goggles, hair-protections and masks are a must
--How Dãmasa went from Trepidation to Trust
--Why it’s not just about costumes and privilege
--How 70,000 people embody bougie creativity
--How Playa Names come to be
TRANSCRIPT:
Janelle Orion 0:01
Andrea, hi friend, hi friend. And
Andrea Enright 0:03
to the brave hearts listening out there. Welcome to permission to be human. I'm Andrea
Janelle Orion 0:08
and I'm Janelle.
Andrea Enright 0:08
Get ready for some real time relationship. Woo
and wisdom from the front lines with occasional tantrums and tears about
how breaking rules, blurring boundaries and tossing tradition can be catalysts for finding your truth.
Janelle Orion 0:20
Let's debunk the fairy tales we were told as children and create a new map for life. Yes, Disney can go fuck itself if you're seeking permission to choose your own path. Freedom is the new F word. People and want to feel less alone along the way, we got you. Please
Andrea Enright 0:36
note, this is our side of the story. Our partners and metamours have their own individual experiences, and we do not speak for them.
Hi, Janelle, hey Andrea and hi damisa.
Welcome to permission to be human. Y'all Bravehearts, we are doing something totally new on this episode. We're interviewing our first guest, Damas the Doyle is janelle's Temple mate.
Janelle Orion 1:10
Love that new word at the goddess temple.
Andrea Enright 1:14
They both just returned from Burning Man.
Janelle Orion 1:17
You can see the dust on the spirit crowns, and this
Andrea Enright 1:21
was janelle's Ninth Burning Man, whereas it was Damas first Burning Man, yes. And to be clear, I have never been to Burning Man, so I have lots of questions, and I'll be interviewing them about their experience. So we're just gonna dive deep into the
Burning Man thing. Here we go.
Janelle Orion 1:41
Damasa, yeah. Yes, what
made you want to go? And were you nervous?
Damasa Perry Doyle 1:49
Okay, so my decision to go was based on, like, years ago in 2009 I wanted to go, and then my dad passed away, and I didn't my idea of Burning Man was that I was going to be in the desert grieving over my dad, around a bunch of like, drunk and, yeah, high people, like, on drugs. And I was like, No, I don't think that's a good good look for me. And so I decided not to go. But then I met Janelle, and one of the maybe not the first thing she said to me, but the second thing was, yeah, you we're going to burning, man, you know, we're
Andrea Enright 2:36
going to burn. Oh, yeah, there's no choice, right? There was no
Damasa Perry Doyle 2:39
choice for sure, so that's pretty much.
Andrea Enright 2:42
So you weren't Okay, so you weren't nervous, but you said you were concerned. Yes, you were worried about, like, fitting in, maybe
Damasa Perry Doyle 2:52
not so much fitting in, but almost like, where is there a place for me? You know, like, vibrationally, I'm not like a big partier, and I also hadn't seen that many black folks or bipoc people in the pics. It was just a lot of white women with cornbrosan braids.
Janelle Orion 3:11
Love it. You
Damasa Perry Doyle 3:19
would say it,
Janelle Orion 3:20
I would, I would totally say it,
Damasa Perry Doyle 3:24
yeah. So I was like, concerned, like, what like, are they going to be? Just a bunch of people appropriating culture? And I was kind of hesitant about that, yeah. But then when I got there, people were really lovely, and they welcomed me, and I felt like, I felt like people's artistic expression and their joy, and they were being really creative and wearing protective hairstyles. And I dig that, because that's what we do in my culture,
Andrea Enright 3:57
wearing protective hairstyles. Okay, interesting connection.
So I'm thinking that I can relate to this as well. Because I'm like, Oh, is this really for me? Do I really want to party that much? It sounds like a lot of stimulation and a really big fucking mess and chaos that I really just cannot handle. Basically. I mean, this is why don't camp? I don't mind shitting in the woods. It's the Maya, the mess and chaos that I cannot stand. Okay, so you were nervous, but obviously you had Janelle going with you, and she's like the perfect person to usher anyone into the Burning Man experience, because she's been so many times. So it was, it was good for you, Janelle. Do you want to comment on this at all?
Janelle Orion 4:41
Yeah, yeah, my comment is that there is still messing chaos I was not able to protect. Oh, no, I'm sure, I'm sure
Andrea Enright 4:48
there's no, yeah. I'm under no illusion that if I go I'll just have to deal with it, right? But you weren't worried about that. Were you worried about kind of it being like,
Damasa Perry Doyle 4:57
No, I wasn't. I wasn't. I'm. I'm ex military, and I used to work in the hospitality industry, and so for me, wildness, mess and chaos and being able to find structure in those spaces has not ever been a problem.
Andrea Enright 5:15
Okay, I was gonna say, what is the military? How are you like? Oh, I was in the military, therefore burning. Man, what do you mean? That's really interesting. You know how to make a mess out
of you made structure. I'm sorry, structure. Create structure
out of chaos, right?
Damasa Perry Doyle 5:29
And also you need to, you know, you need to know what to do. You're out in the elements. How do you handle yourself? Yeah, where do you go? To the bathroom? How do you pace yourself? Like all of that was really important, and those are skill How do you work in a group? Yeah, that's really important to work in a group, but also to be able to take care of yourself. What was it? Self Reliance? Radical self reliance. Okay, yeah. She knows all the principles and all the like, yeah,
Andrea Enright 5:58
it sort of sounds like an episode of Survivor, though, I'm thinking that too, right? Because you are, you are, you know, I mean, I'm just the way that you just described it, and it's like, that's survivor in a group, in the elements. Gotta figure it out. Obviously, you're not purposely being challenged, but you were challenged, right? Yes, and it was
Damasa Perry Doyle 6:16
a Bougie. It's very bougie survivor, like, let's get be clear. Like, we had an RV, we had a bathroom. We were not just in a tent out in the wilderness. It was
Andrea Enright 6:29
bougie. Totally get that? Okay, yeah? Like, yeah. We
Janelle Orion 6:32
also in, this is my first year. We were at Muse cafe and camp, and we had power. So we actually didn't even have to run a generator. It was so decadent. So it's like glamping. It's glamping, glamping, for sure. You're glamping in a harsh environment. That's why, where the chaos comes from? Yeah,
Andrea Enright 6:50
get it. Okay, so you camped at Muse cafe. Describe Muse cafe, for me,
Janelle Orion 6:56
it's an incredible female run camp that honors the feminine and the Muse as inspiration. Our main showcase was a cabaret and burlesque show. Again, I think it's a little bit different than survivor.
Andrea Enright 7:08
Were you in the cabaret and burlesque show, or I was a
Janelle Orion 7:12
cocktail server of frozen grapes? Oh,
of course. Then what about you? What did you do?
Damasa Perry Doyle 7:19
I actually outside of the fluffing that we did, which was taking care of the people who were building the camp, because the building the camp was not my ministry, and so I was glad to like fluff and make smoothies and make sure everybody ate and felt good and got hosed down and felt cool in the desert heat. And I also was invited to do the invocation at the beginning of the kickoff, which was really nice. Okay,
Andrea Enright 7:51
so little bit of backstory here they you drove from Denver in an RV. No, no, and there were three of us. There were you? You two, Janelle, damassa and your friend Gabby. Yes, right? Yeah, three priestesses, and it was Gabby's first time as well. Yes. So first, I've just had this whole, like, Muse Cafe camp. Like, what do you mean by camp, right? Like, I don't understand what a camp is. I've never been to Burning Man. So, like, how many camps are there? How many people are in your camp who decided you to the camp? Are you headed the camp? Like, what does camp even mean? Lots
Janelle Orion 8:24
of questions. So Burning Man is a temporary city of 70,000 people. It's actually the fourth largest city in Nevada the week that it's going on. Okay? And so it just makes sense to be in camps. Now, how many camps are there? I don't know, but in the 1000s and 1000s, most camp size range from 10 people to like 250. Would be a very large camp, okay, Muse cafe with 70 people.
Andrea Enright 8:51
Do you have to be in a camp?
Janelle Orion 8:52
Nope, you don't have to be in a camp. But I do wreck. I mean, I think it's, it's an immediate community that you form when you, when you are in one and you go on the Burning Man website, and you could look for camps at this point. I know enough people who go, so I knew the women who are running this camp. Okay, so it was easy to just apply for it, but you do apply, you apply and you pay dues.
Andrea Enright 9:14
Okay? For most got it. Okay. Okay. So I understand that structure. You need a ticket to go to Burning Man, though, correct, right? In addition to this camp, this camp is the camps are set up just from by the people. There's nothing official about it. Really correct, community thing, okay?
Janelle Orion 9:30
And each one has a theme. Ours was, as I said, like we had a cabaret show and a cafe. Other camps have bars. Other camps are an art car, and they drive people around like they're very creative. They could be there's They run the gamut of creativity. And so you, you would join a camp, most likely based on what their offering is, because then you're going to be with people who also align with that offering.
Damasa Perry Doyle 9:53
Yeah, as far as the camps, like, I felt really good in the camp that we were at, but. It, you know, I didn't know how I would fit in, because I didn't think the pics of the average person in jeans and T shirts and bandana were like getting play on social media. Like I didn't see that. I saw the big hats, the sparkly stuff, the little bigger crowns, you know, bless, bless them, bless the Little Women running around half naked, and I was just like, oh, ooh, am I 1am? I gonna even be able to be naked? Or, like, is that a thing?
Andrea Enright 10:29
Yeah, I need the pictures which, I think what you're what I'm hearing you say is, like, you know, all the pictures you've shown me, and all of the many pictures in, for example, the collage bathroom on the other side of this duplex, or all the pictures I've seen, no one is in a tank top and jeans. And so what you're saying is there are people who don't, yeah,
Damasa Perry Doyle 10:49
there were actually. So all the pictures I seen, everybody was outrageously dressed and glitzy and all of this for years, that's the image that I had of Burning Man, right? And and then when I got there, I saw people of all ages. I saw children, and I saw people just in, like, cut off jeans, their bandanas, like, chilling, doing their thing. And that's really great.
Andrea Enright 11:14
Okay, all right, cool. So I've heard so many things about Burning Man from Janelle And and a couple other people I know that go just a couple, and at one point I really wanted to go, and have since felt like, do I belong there? Is it my people? Like, in your opinion, domicile, like, who belongs at Burning Man?
Damasa Perry Doyle 11:33
Yeah, I really think that Burning Man is, honestly, now that I've been I think that Burning Man is for everybody.
Andrea Enright 11:41
Everybody, yeah, parents even
Damasa Perry Doyle 11:46
listen. I have a friend. Her name is Shonda, and she won't mind me saying this. She's gone with her parents for the last 10 years, and I saw people with kids. Somebody even bought a goat. Controversial, but it did. It did happen. I didn't see the goat, but I heard
Andrea Enright 12:07
about it. Okay, so, so, yeah, anybody wants to go?
Damasa Perry Doyle 12:11
Anybody, anybody who wants to go, and can, you know, adhere to the principles, or at least understand them. I think it's really welcome. Yeah.
Andrea Enright 12:23
So what was your intention in going, like, what did you want to get out of it?
Damasa Perry Doyle 12:29
Yeah, so for me, I was really there to be in ritual and to connect with the land and the elements and spend time at the temple which they built. And, like, I don't just the fact that they built a temple and it was gorgeous, but, yeah, I wanted to be at the temple and doing pieces shit. I do energy work. I help people move things out of their system. So that was what I gifted when I got there, and that that's also one of the principles, is that it's the system is of giving, of gifting. And, I mean, everything is gifted, everything, yeah, you don't have to buy anything after you get that ticket, pay those dues. Yeah.
Andrea Enright 13:12
I think it's a common misconception about Burning Man, is that I thought it was a trade thing, and you've told you've corrected me, that it's just a giving. No, you just give. There's no tip for tat rather,
Janelle Orion 13:22
yeah, and then giving could be, you know, I went to see something called lucins dossier, which was essentially like a spiritual Cirque du Soleil. The performance was unbelievable. The costumes were unbelievable. The stage, the lighting, the production value, unbelievable. All a gift, all the people who put that on, I mean, 10s and 10s and 10s of 1000s of dollars a gift to those of us who got to see it. Wow.
Andrea Enright 13:48
Okay, so Damascus said, like, you love dancing, you love watching the sunrise, like meditating under the stars. So that was part of the vibe too. Was just that nature connecting,
Damasa Perry Doyle 14:00
right? Like that was all there for me. I didn't know that was going to be there for me, but when I got there and I was like, oh my goodness, there's, there's so much space, and I could, I can do all of those things, all the things that I really love. I mean, to really sit under the stars and watch the moon rise is amazing. So that was really my burn, besides fluff, the fluffing that we did. So I really believe, like, whatever your vibe is, you're bound to find it and unless, unless you're mean, like, yeah, like, don't be mean mean people, it's not going to work out. Although I do think that if you, if you are mean, if you go in there and you have a mean spirit, that people are going to hug you and they're going to give you things, they're going to feed you, they're going to take care of you, they're going to help you fix your bike, and so you're going to end up like hugging everyone and feeling super loved by the end.
Janelle Orion 14:58
Yeah, yeah. That's nice. Nice.
You're doing. So great. Okay,
Andrea Enright 15:04
so what did you overestimate?
Damasa Perry Doyle 15:10
I definitely overestimated my ability to navigate the dust because we had it's super easy. There were like, blue skies for the first four or five days, and then the dust hit, and I finally understood all the prep stuff Janelle and sisters that we bring, like, what? Like goggles, vinegar and water, whatever, face masks, the face masks, yeah, like all of that. Like, it was really important, like, to cover your hair, to cover your mouth, like, like, at some point you just couldn't even see the person right in front of
Andrea Enright 15:48
you. Oh, my God, this is like a whole other element of of like, that sounds awful, right? Goggles on you wear goggles the whole time, the masks the whole like, a lot of the time. Such a such a such a barrier between you and the how do you So, tell me more. Yeah,
Janelle Orion 16:06
so that's what you would think, right? Because you're not in it. But we actually had the experience. So the dust only came the night of the temple burn, actually the last night of burning, man. Oh, and then the next day, when we were getting ready to leave. So I don't know how big the temple structure is, but many stories tall. And, you know, think of the size of a very, very large mansion, and that gets burned the last night of Burning Man, and the dust came in. So this huge structure is on fire, and the dust came in so strong and you could, we couldn't see the fire.
Damasa Perry Doyle 16:43
Oh, wow, yeah.
Andrea Enright 16:44
And how far away was that from you, though? I mean, like,
Janelle Orion 16:47
I don't know, 500 feet something. Oh, yeah, got it. You couldn't see the fire. You couldn't see the fire. The white out, like, because it was white out, okay, exactly. And there's something so powerful to be sitting in the dark under the stars in a whiteout condition, not able to see this like other force of nature, fire in front of you, right there. So there's something very visceral that happens, and then having to navigate our way home in the sand, in the dark, in the white out conditions, right? It brings up so many emotions. It brings up fear. It can bring up confusion, it can bring up like. And yet, I actually said this to Gabby. She was like, but what about I don't know where we are? And I said, I don't know where we are, but I'm not lost, because there are signature points to figure out. And so it was just trusting that we were going to find our way home in conditions that were very unusual,
Andrea Enright 17:43
beautiful. Okay, so what else did you overestimate?
Damasa Perry Doyle 17:48
Well, first I want to say to janelle's point is that there was this feeling. There was a moment of like, Am I safe? And like, where are my people? And luckily, we had chimes and bells and things. And so I remember at one point where I didn't see Janelle And but I heard her ringing this this bell. And I was like, Oh, let me focus on that. Like I can't see her, but I can hear her. And so we just worked together to keep together, and that created a sense of safety.
Andrea Enright 18:25
Really beautiful.
Janelle Orion 18:26
I never heard about that, too. This was during a ritual that Gabby damasat and Sophie, Sophie Howell of the Spirit crowns, did during after the temple had burned when we were walking around. It was so beautiful. Thank you, Sophie, for inspiring that ritual
Andrea Enright 18:43
so beautiful. I'm just like, feeling getting, like, such a feeling of like, having to constantly surrender,
yeah, yeah.
Janelle Orion 18:54
So something that I overestimated was the amount of food that we brought the camp. We were in a camp at muse. They provided dinner, and so everyone was in a pod, and we helped make dinner one night, and then they actually also provided snacks. We brought so much food with us, like so much food we came home, it felt like as much food as we brought. Yeah, and last year, I free camp, so I had to provide all my own meals and everything else. And it was, it was, it was different. So if somehow I just, there's just so many camps giving away food, right? We got we were gifted peaches and we were gifted pickles and we were gifted grilled cheese and and waffles and so waffles with pork belly.
Damasa Perry Doyle 19:37
So good, so good. Bless you. Whoever gave me that, Bless you, bless you for the rest of your your years, and all your language,
Janelle Orion 19:46
pork belly and waffle
Andrea Enright 19:47
so you had too much food. Yes, that's great. Yeah. So
Janelle Orion 19:50
that was an overestimation. Okay,
Andrea Enright 19:52
okay, back to you, Thomas,
Damasa Perry Doyle 19:53
okay. I totally overestimated. I knew there was going to be art, art installations. Yeah. And I thought it was going to be sprinkled around. There were actually 303 150 about art installations over what was the distance? It's two mile, two mile conference, yeah, okay, yeah. And I overestimated being able to visit all the art. And I really got to see about 5% of that, 350 because it was so far. It was so far, and also it was very confusing. I got lost
Andrea Enright 20:31
right to keep track of where you are, and so did you just not stray very far from where you were? And did you have bikes?
Damasa Perry Doyle 20:40
Okay, so, all right, every question's like, this is fun because, because I did not have a bike, and so Janelle, Janelle has an E bike. And she was like, I was like, Oh, do I need to get an E bike because I don't want to be left in the dust, like, literally. And so then she's like, No, no. It's really better. You know, the bike, the regular bike, a pedal bike, to have it is going to be great. Let me just tell you something.
Andrea Enright 21:09
I heard her say that too in the house, right? I always actually hear it when you asked about it. You're like, do you think I need an E bike? And you're like, No, no, okay. I don't even know what's gonna happen here, but can't wait. What's next? What happened?
Damasa Perry Doyle 21:21
Oh, my God, it was like, just imagine trying to ride a pedal bike with dust, like waves of dust, drifts of dust. And sometimes it was just so hard. And I just at one point wanted to throw the bike down and kick it and leave it there. Because I was just like, oh my god, this is so much. But I figured it out. And then at one point I couldn't bike because I danced too much and kind of had a swollen knee. And so then Janelle had to ride me on her E on the bike, back of her e bike, which was actually very satisfying. Oh, I
Andrea Enright 22:03
bet you're just like, Oh, yeah.
Damasa Perry Doyle 22:06
I was like, now you have pedal bike by
Janelle Orion 22:10
Wait, so
Andrea Enright 22:11
why? Yeah, I
guess. Or like, did you have anything? Do you have anything to say about that? Janelle, yeah,
Janelle Orion 22:16
I don't know
what the ratio is now, but you bet you're relatively new at burning. Man, I've only had one last year as my first year. Yeah, Memphis gifted it to me. So there's also challenges. The knee bike has to be charged if it something breaks. I mean, there's a lot more complications to it, yeah, but I will also say I underestimate the fact that I was a professional cyclist for 20 years. Oh, yeah. So battle biking for me is actually very easy and very enjoyable. And for people who haven't spent that much time on a bike, I can see that it's not
Andrea Enright 22:43
I'm so glad that you're doing this first, right? Because I am also, like, really not a biker,
and so I will settle for nothing less than the bike. Or, I don't know, I'm gonna get one of those, but, yeah,
okay, got it noted so you, so you biked. I guess my original question was, that's the bike story. So did you go far from your camp? You did several times, but you said you just couldn't see all the art. But that's fine. It's just
Damasa Perry Doyle 23:06
so spread out. So just to bike like a pedal bike, if you bike all the way out to the farthest, the furthest piece of art, it could take you, like, 30 to 40 minutes. Got it? Okay, right? So it's just so getting to one thing could take that long.
Andrea Enright 23:27
Gotcha okay. So what else did you or I'm sorry, Janelle, you want to talk about clothes? Yes. So
Janelle Orion 23:32
another thing that I overestimated this year was that I just take my entire closet and at this point now, from my home, and then put it into the bins and take it to the burn. There is really no difference between what I wear every day and then what I wear at Burning Man. But this year, I had had this like vision that for my for my hair protection, I was going to put in gray hair, so I went with ombre, gray to white hair, and had the vision that I should be wearing white, which I've never worn at Burning Man, I don't wear a lot of white here. So I was like, I'm really struggling. I don't have a lot of white clothes, but I've got this vision that I'm supposed to be wearing white. But I was like, Okay, well, maybe I'm just gonna, at times, be like, really calling in that archetype of, like, the the wise medicine woman, elder Crone, and I'll be wearing my other clothes. As it turned out, I was actually in that archetype the whole time. I was called to wear white almost every day, all the time, and so I just, I had to repeat. I just wore the same clothes again and again. I wore this beard crown, like four days in a row, which is not how I usually do it. Usually do it. So in the end, I needed, like, three outfits in a spirit crown. It was so simple. The simplicity is so appealing. Yes, yeah. And it was really, it was really fun being in that
Andrea Enright 24:51
archetype. Wow. I just want to, like, ask a quick question, though. You said, Well, really, how I dress here is how I dress at Burning Man. And I mean, again. Added, but no, that's an exaggeration, and I just want to point because if I was listening on the other end as a Braveheart, I'd be like, I'm really wearing spirit crowns and all this, like, boob hanging out stuff when you go to Safeway. I don't think so. So
Janelle Orion 25:12
I'm breaking laws, but I'm not, like, I'm not walking around Denver nude, but yes, you know, I wear a lot of robes,
Andrea Enright 25:22
and you do, but you don't wear spirit crowns around all the time. And I guess the pictures I see of you at Burning Man are not what you wear here. So that just was, like confusing to me. I think
Janelle Orion 25:31
that the spirit crowns, like, I'm thinking of a couple of different years, like, I mean, literally, all of the outfits that I wore at Burning Man, I have worn to an event here in Denver or something,
Andrea Enright 25:43
an event, yes, okay, that's an important, I think that's a Yeah, event or celebration, not like every day, but that, I think that makes sense. And I think it's just an important, like, understanding of you can wear whatever you want it sounds like at Burning Man. And usually you take all your clothing and you kind of put together an outfit every day, right? You kind of feel into the day, or feel into what you're like, what spirit is telling you that day? Yeah, I'm guessing, yeah, yeah. Okay, so that makes sense. Odama says something about an overestimation, yeah, yeah. The
Damasa Perry Doyle 26:15
overestimation that I had that that actually made me feel a little bit sad, was like people honoring the Paiute tribe's culture and history we're giving talks about the history and culture of the land. I really thought that there would be more ability to connect with and interact and learn from the people who have been caretakers of that land for the past 10,000 years, and so I signed up for some workshops that spoke about the history. It's like the history and culture of Black Rock City and the indigenous culture was missing from that. And so that made me really sad. However, it also gave me an opportunity to speak up about it and say, Hey, what about the people who live here? What about the history of the elders and and the native people of this land? And what was really lovely was that there were other people in in the group who were there, also the workshop, in the workshop who it was more like a talk, they actually were like, Yeah, what about that? Like, we've been coming here, and we really want to know, we want to know about the culture of the land before the immigrants came over and and took over the land. And so it's interesting, because there's this opportunity. I kind of got a sense of wow, if I had not gone to Burning Man, then my voice would have been missing from that conversation, yeah, and I'm really glad that I had the opportunity to speak about that.
Andrea Enright 28:04
Yeah, so what I'm hearing you were like a needed voice at Burning Man to make sure that the message about the history is spread. Yeah, wow. Amazing. This
Janelle Orion 28:14
is so exciting. And there's such a blend here. That same day of that talk, she went to a couple of others that what else came to you on that day?
Damasa Perry Doyle 28:29
I think you're talking about after the talk,
Janelle Orion 28:32
yeah, when you got your name.
Damasa Perry Doyle 28:34
Oh my goodness. Okay, so a couple of things happened after I left to talk a little bit early, because I really, I was just like, Okay, I'm complete. And I left, and I still was feeling that sadness and frustration. And I went, and I heard somebody playing the saxophone, and like these, like Afro beats. And I was like, what? And I look and there's like a DJ with a saxophone, and I started dancing, and it was so good, because I was just really just dancing, dancing, dancing. And then after that, I went to this other workshop about hugging, because it's called Heart to Heart hugging. And so I was like, I want to learn about Heart to Heart hugging. And while I was there, I was gifted with my Playa name, which every I'd heard about, because Janelle has a Playa name, and other people have a Playa name that Janelle knows. And so they were like, you can't make it up yourself. It has to be given to you. And so there was a man who who was running the workshop, and because of something I spoke about, about relationships and relating, and how women actually have orgasms, and how they might cry and laugh during the orgasm, and that's part of the wave.
Andrea Enright 29:57
The wave. It was part of the part of the way, the way they're feeling orgasm, yes, totally
Damasa Perry Doyle 30:04
allow it. And afterwards, he was like, thank you so much. I'm the person who helps people find their Playa names, and so I would like to bestow on you the name of gift like you the lights and the sparkles and oh my gosh,
Janelle Orion 30:22
oh my god, I
Damasa Perry Doyle 30:24
gotta play a name, yeah, yeah. So by using my voice, I got a pioneer. And so my my Burning Man pie name is gift. Wow.
Andrea Enright 30:35
You're a bestowed with your name right after, and this was after you spoke up. Is that this was that day. Oh so tied. Yeah,
Damasa Perry Doyle 30:43
wow. Wait. So
Andrea Enright 30:46
I missed the part about, like, what does this have to do with the crying and the laughing and the orgasm? Okay? Because,
Damasa Perry Doyle 30:53
because he was talking, he was hugging a woman, uh huh, and she laughed during the hook. And he said, Okay, guys, I just want you to know it was mostly guys. It was me and this other woman there and then, like 10 guys, guys, I just want you to know that, you know, don't feel bad when a woman laughs Like sometimes it could be that she is feeling a little bit insecure, or she's had trauma or something's happened in her life. And I was like, Um, excuse me, sir. Uh, May I share? And he was like, Yeah. And I said, I just want to let you know that I actually laugh like a maniac during sex, and he was like, oh, and I was like, and it's not because of trauma, it's actually because I'm in my joy, and that's my way of expressing joy. And that when a woman is in an orgasmic state, any emotion can come up, right? It can also be tears. It could be tears of joy. It could be sadness, for the release, it could be anything, but I said all of it should be welcome. And if a man would just take the time hold the woman's heart and just be with her and allow her to feel these emotions and these waves, then he's gonna have a really good time. And it's also saying that he is that she's feeling comfortable enough to actually release and be in the fullness of her orgasm instead of blocking her emotions.
Beautiful. Okay, thank
you for explaining that. Yeah. And
now I'm just like, I just caught this, like, really lovely contrast. Also, of, oh my god, it's just, yeah, it's just too much. I don't know. To cut this out. I don't know, but I have to say it that, like, I know Janelle, that you're a laugher, right? I mean, I don't know. Like, I haven't seen you orgasm that many
Andrea Enright 33:02
times. I mean for that to be the funny part, but true,
maybe a couple times, but I'm thinking,
you're a laugher, right? Because you're usually laughing. You laugh when like you laugh and shake, yeah, I don't know, yeah.
Janelle Orion 33:16
I've been crying more of a crier these days. Yeah? Well, I'm
Andrea Enright 33:19
just, I might so like, interesting, because I was just thinking, I'm like, Oh, that is so fucking typical. You laugh and I cry.
Like, I'm like, because, like, oh, there is that huge contrast there, right? But it's all a release. And we've talked about this many times on the podcast too, yeah, that is just, and I just, I love that that's what you stood up and been like, Um, hello. That's not always about trauma. That's about women expressing the wave of how they're feeling, which is always totally allowed, yeah. So, all right, and
Janelle Orion 33:54
so this is Burning Man, this right? Like a random moment with a random group of people, this gets to be the conversation. Permission is given by a stranger speaking her truth. Yes,
Andrea Enright 34:05
completely. Okay. Okay, so we're gonna talk now a little bit about what you underestimated. Okay,
Damasa Perry Doyle 34:13
all right. So, by the way, I also sing when I orgasm. It's a new thing, but I love doing it, yeah, and it's great. That's a good idea. My partner said, I'm like, Just hold on. Just hold on to me. Let me just sit down there.
Yeah? Love it. Love it. Underestimate,
okay, oh my goodness, I underestimated the distance between the damn porta potties and D Playa and deep Playa is when you're way out there and there's no porta potties, and you want to see that extra piece of art, or you hear music, and you're like, what's that? Or something shimmering and shiny in the distance, and you're like, Oh my God, I want to go see that. Oh my goodness, I have a little more energy on this. Fucking pedal bike, and then your bladder is like, Hello, yeah, no, you need to go back. You need to go back to your RV and find a porta potty, because you are not going to make it. So
Janelle Orion 35:12
something that I underestimated was the ease of my living situation and what that meant being with two sisters, Damas and Gabby, who were totally capable in handling the environment that even though they had never been there before, that they like, took on every experience with joy, and that we had power at our camp for RV, it was totally decadent and easeful. And what that meant was that I all of my energy then was spent towards being in service, gifting through ritual or through a sacred ceremony, and through hugs or joy or laughter in my presence. And so I just felt so much more resourced. I underestimated the amount of resourcing, I would feel that my living situation was so useful and fun, great.
Damasa Perry Doyle 36:07
Yeah, I would say ditto. Like everything Janelle just said, there was for me, I really underestimated the amount of joy and fun and excitement and freedom that I would feel out there. I felt when they burned the man. I actually felt like a little kid, like I was like, oh my god, oh my god. That was shrieking and clapping. And I was like a toddler who was like, saw their first like, fireworks. It was amazing. It was it just really expanded my my child energy. And really it was like, on town for for so much of the awesome of the time, yeah,
Andrea Enright 36:56
like, the only thing more joyful than you damasa right now is watching Janelle watch you.
She's like, so happy. She's like, a proud parent. She's like, see what I did, see what I did.
It's so adorable. Both are, like, big, white, like, deep, like, you both have these huge smiles. Like, it's really something,
Janelle Orion 37:17
it's really something honor to witness.
Damasa Perry Doyle 37:18
It's like, she got her kid to eat brussels sprouts, yeah? Because I was like, Oh no, I
Andrea Enright 37:25
don't think so. I'm not sure about that. Yeah, you're not sure. No, even up to the Yeah, up to the point, and I hadn't really talked to you about it, so I didn't know that.
Damasa Perry Doyle 37:33
Yeah, I wanted to pull out, yeah, yeah. You said you were hoping you're like, maybe
Andrea Enright 37:37
something won't happen, right? So that's how I'm going to be too. So, so what is Playa magic? And what were some of your experiences of the playa magic?
Damasa Perry Doyle 37:49
So Playa magic, for me is when things align in a way that seems almost impossible. And so one of the things that was really great is that I went out to see an art piece, and I just happened to have just had a conversation with some other people about our grandmothers or whatever, and that was like magical. And then I go out and I see this square, and I go inside the square, not knowing what to find. And I find a shaman singing Peruvian ICOs and doing Olympias, which are energetic clearings and cleansings. And so for me, this was magical, because I was like, Oh my God. I found my people as I just been in the jungle of Peru, oh. And I was taught, encouraged by my by my shaman, his name is Hill mayor, to sing Ikaros. So I was sitting there watching this man do cleansings and clearings, and I started singing Ikaros. And it was like when I asked anybody else around me, like, later on, like, oh, have you been there? Like, was the man in there? And they're like, no, there was no man. There was no man seeing ik rose. There was no man doing cleansings. And I was like, Oh, my goodness, I got to experience that moment of that man being there, exactly when I showed up. That was magical. That's bio
Andrea Enright 39:20
magic. Yeah, about you.
Janelle Orion 39:23
I asked many moments of Playa magic, the two that I'll speak to happened within an hour of each other, which was that Ziya and I, my spirit, son, stepson, we were actually at the same camp together. This is a very family, or like Orion family Burning Man. We celebrated Orion family Christmas. We celebrated sunrise together. And on the night of sunrise, I had committed to Zaya that we were going to meet at this one camp called mystic at sunrise. And but everyone that I was with. I had decided to go home at like, 3am and I didn't know how I was going to meet him, but I was in complete trust that I would. And I also decided that even if he had gone to bed, I was committed to, like, saying, doing what I said I was going to do, to stay up until sunrise. So I was on this like, you know, 3am 4am, 5am like wandering the playa by myself, journey, finding magical moments along the way. But then was like, Okay, I don't know what am I supposed to do now? And I was called to the temple, and I had my chimes on me, and so I drove, I biked on my E bike to the temple. It's like, probably 430 ish AM, and just started doing blessings with my chimes. And then after about 20 minutes or so, or half an hour, I get a tap on my shoulder, and I turn around, and there's Ziya and Rachel and Memphis and Cassie. Oh my God, just at me. And it was just like, like, my joy was like, and I was like, but I was also like, of course, of course, that's what happened. So we then go back to Memphis RV, get warm, get more clothes, to go all the way out to sunrise, to the to the trash fence for sunrise, we get out to the trash fence, and all of a sudden, I look over here, permission, permission. And I look over and I see this being walking, not on a bike, covered in blankets, and it's done so, and she had decided somehow not to go to bed, hitched a ride on an art car came out. Wizard didn't think she was gonna find me, but was just
like, Oh well, I'm good.
I'm good. She's like, Oh my God. We ended up finding each other for sunrise. It was wild, wild.
That is so amazing.
Damasa Perry Doyle 41:53
Most exciting moments because I was like, the guy who dropped me off. Like he was like, Oh, are you going to be able to get back? And I was like, Oh, I'll be fine. And I was thinking, Oh, my God, I'm going to be walking for two hours. I was like, I'll figure it out. And then, and then I was like, Oh, I wonder where Janelle is. And I was thinking, I was like, I could go in this direction or that direction, towards the temple. And so I chose to slightly, turn slightly to go towards to face the temple. And just as I turned in that direction, by the way, in the middle of the desert, so it's, there's, it's not a block, or there's no sign, yeah, I know. Like, I'm so I think the temple's that way, I turn slightly, and then I'm like, I thought it was a mirage. Like, what the fuck like, Oh my god. You
Andrea Enright 42:47
thought it wasn't gonna waste it like,
Damasa Perry Doyle 42:49
I was like, I'm tired, you hurt. I'm out here by myself. I might be a little hungry and thirsty. And I was just like, seeing vision. Oh my goodness. And I start screaming and hobbling towards and so it was, it was the best. It was the
best. Yeah, so, playing Magic, wow,
Andrea Enright 43:11
playing Magic. Oh my gosh. You guys are really, really this is, this is the most I've talked about Burning Man, probably ever, yeah, all right, well
Janelle Orion 43:20
now, so I'm now the last question Andrea is for you now that you've listened to what we've said and to our impressions, uh huh. You know, I've heard you say you're interested. Now you're not interested. How are you feeling right now?
Andrea Enright 43:32
I just say I have gone through a little, a little couple waves here as I've been listening to you. One that I am, that I've had some kind of a regression, that I am not in the magic right now that's okay, like it happens, right? We come around to the same side of the mountain, like I've been here before. I feel like, oh, all of the people that are there who are finding the magic know themselves and know how to take care of themselves and have really good boundaries. That's what kept coming to me, was like, knowing, and I don't know, I don't know that may not be true for you guys, but for me, it's like, oh, you have to know who you are, where you want to go. When to say, no, no, thanks. Oh yes, I'm in. When to think I'm gonna, think I'm gonna find my way back to the RV? No, I think I'm not gonna find my way back to the RV and just trust, right? Like, even, and even if you don't know for sure, like you have a feeling, you're following an intuition, and you're trusting. So it feels like, I think that is something I constantly struggle with. It's like, okay, no, I just have to trust like I believe that the most, and I also struggle with it the most, and it's fairly normal, but still, you just keep trusting. So I can see myself just being like, okay, it's great. Okay, it's
great. Just constantly, when I'm at 30 minutes, I'm like, Oh, can
Janelle Orion 44:57
I do it?
Can I like,
Andrea Enright 44:59
go? Go and be okay with the goggles. And like, you know, I know. I know what it's like to be like, No, that's gonna be too hard. Because, right? And I also know what it's like to like, no, it's just, it's gonna be fine, because I will make it fine. So I just, I see this, the dichotomy and the like, like, hitting my edge and also finding so much bliss and freedom and love and magic when coming to that edge, but
it's really hard for me. Like, so I'm, yeah, I'm just
just, that's what I'm getting the most out of. And like, wow, yeah, I That sounds amazing. So I mean, I feel like I'm reintroduced to
it in a way. Yeah, I'll stop talking for a minute. What do you guys say? I
Damasa Perry Doyle 45:47
was just gonna say, like, first of all, this woman speaks for me because I was, that's where I was at. I was like, I don't know if I want to deal with this. I don't know if I'm gonna, like, have the energetics, all these people, all of this, like energy, but what you're saying is true. It's trust. It's really just a trust, a trust that if what you need to do is stay near your camp and enjoy what's around there, then that's fine. And a trust that if you want to venture out and go and see the great beyond where there's no porta potties, that's fine, too. I trust that if you want to do plant medicine journey, or you just want to dance a little bit and like take workshops, that is all exactly what it's supposed to be like. What you find is what you need. That's what I didn't know, and that's what I know now. And I'm resisting the urge to be like Janelle, who was like, No, you're gonna love it. It's gonna be great. Because now I've been drinking the Kool Aid. I'm just saying,
Andrea Enright 47:00
Okay, no, I really, it's been really beautiful to hear this whole thing, and I hear all of your just the trust that you had, right? Damasa, going in, I mean, like, okay, you know. And just again and again, okay, yeah, just, it's a terrible time. It's when school starts every fucking year. So I've always been like, Okay, I'll just have to wait until my daughter is like, you know which is, which is fine. She'll she's not in school, but, yeah, that's a logistic. Um, that's
Damasa Perry Doyle 47:29
what I did though. Yeah, yeah. My, my youngest just is going off to college now, so he's finished, so I could
Andrea Enright 47:37
go. Yeah, that does what I kind of what maybe then maybe that's when it'll be the right time to go. I'll know when it's the right time to go. I feel like as well, if I stay, if I stay open to it. One more thing I wanted to mention is that when I did my introduction on a women's circle that I joined recently, I said one of the ways I describe myself is that I am all about meeting strangers like, I like a nice, magical stranger, and I typically meet a magical stranger on a regular basis. That's just like, what happens for me? I love it. It's just like, reinforces my belief of good in the world. And it's just such a delight.
And it feels like, I mean, Burning Man is like, the land of magical strangers. How can I not go like, this
Janelle Orion 48:20
is my thing. So,
Andrea Enright 48:22
yeah, it feels very aligned in that way.
Janelle Orion 48:28
So, great,
Damasa Perry Doyle 48:29
yeah, the only Yeah, the one thing I wanted to say was to acknowledge the range of socioeconomic structures that are present before people get to Burning Man. And I want to acknowledge that I received a ticket that was a reduced price because that's what I could afford, and that the Burning Man Corporation, I don't know, called org like made that available, which I think is really important. And also, we were at Camp muse, who actually gave four kind of scholarships to artists so that they could come and they didn't have to pay the dues and all of that. And so there's a lot of privilege there. I saw a lot of privileged people with decked out RVs, like, beyond what you could even imagine. And I also saw a lot of people who were just like, had saved up. I had heard stories of people who had saved up so that they could go. And so I love that the organization there, they also offer tickets for free the to some of the people in the Paiute Tribe, so that they can have this experience that's happening on their land. And I think that's really, really, really important.
Andrea Enright 49:56
Okay, thank you for mentioning that too. The cost is significant as well. Yeah, and that is something that Yeah, feels like it's an investment. Wow. Okay, so this has been our first guest episode for permission to be human. Thank you, bravehearts for listening. We love you. Remember we have Braveheart conversations once a month. Please check it out. Permission to be human. Dot live slash events. Follow us on Instagram and stay tuned, because you never know what's coming next. We love you,
Janelle Orion 50:26
and thank you, damasah, for being my temple mate and Burning Man RV buddy and for being our first guest. It
Damasa Perry Doyle 50:33
really was such a pleasure. You guys are a hoot. I like it here.
Janelle Orion 50:41
Thank you so much. Bye.
Do you need permission to be human? You
got it? Listen, subscribe and review on Apple, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts, learn more about us at permission to be human. Dot live you.
Commentaires